Town of New Haven Back to Home
New Haven Planning Commission
New Haven Town Hall
April 6, 2006
Members Present: Allen Karnatz, Tom Boise, Jim Walsh, Donald Johnston,
Susie Leonard
Members Absent: John Evers, Keith Hall
Staff Present: Cris Messerle
Guests: Curtis Cyr, Kevin Brennan, David Wulfson, Brian Elithorpe, Michael Dunbar, Christine Dunbar, Charles Cousino, Paul Cousino, Katherine Selby, Christopher Bray, Tim Bouton, John Madden, Alan Bessette, Curtis Newton
Allen Karnatz, Chairman, Called the meeting to order at 7:00 PM
Public Hearing
1. John and Donna Seguin, wish to subdivide their property, located at 967 South Street into two lots. This is the first hearing on subdivision 2006-SUB-01.
Don Johnston recused himself as he is the surveyor for the Seguin’s.
John Seguin indicated that the total lot is 141 +/- acres and they would like to subdivide a 10.03 acre parcel off for a residence. John Sequin presented the survey Mylar, and the septic plans – showing the primary and replacement systems and the building envelope for the residence on the 10.03 parcel. The pins are in. The Sequin’s have not applied for a building permit as of yet, they were awaiting the Planning Commission’s (PC’s) approval first.
Allen Karnatz indicated that this parcel is located in a 2 acre zone, with 200 foot road frontage. The 50 foot Right-of-Way access located on the survey plan is existing and meets Town Fire Department regulations.
Opened for public comment
Christopher Bray asked if there were additional single lot subdivisions for this parcel planned for the future. If so, would that be a minor/major subdivision and when does the PC asked for a master plan for the parcel.
Tom Boise indicated that a lot can be subdivided into 9 lots throughout a 5 year period before Act 250 becomes in effect. Allen Karnatz indicated as per New Haven Town Regulations, as long as there is sufficient road frontage the remaining land can be subdivided. The PC typically does not ask for a master plan with a minor subdivision. The current subdivision regulations do not require master plans but are usually requested with planned residential developments (PRD’s).
Don Johnston indicated that at this time the Seguin’s do not have a master plan to present, because at this time the Seguin’s haven’t thought about future development. This does not rule out that at some time in the future there maybe a master plan.
John Madden indicated that if there was further subdivision, the Seguin’s would have to come back to the PC for approval.
Public comment period closed
Tom Boise asked if the proposed septic areas have been approved. John Seguin indicated that yes it had with designer and the State Engineer. Tom Boise asked if the PC needed to see the septic plan. Allen Karnatz indicated no, as long as the proper paper work has been filed, the engineer has indicated on the site plan the septic locations and has signed off of the plan. John Seguin indicated that the septic plan is shown on the site plan.
Tom Boise made the motion to accept the plan as presented.
Jim Walsh seconded
Discussion – none
Vote: Yes – 4 No – 0 Abstention – 1 (Don Johnston)
Motion carries
Public hearing closed at 7:30 PM
Visitor’s Business
a) Charles Cousino wishes to subdivide his 13+ acres, located on East Street into two lots.
Charles Cousino indicated that he would like to subdivide off 3.9 acres from his 13.9 acres to create a residential lot for his son, Paul. Currently there is 575 feet of road frontage, which will divide into 350 foot road frontage for Charles Cousino and Paul Cousino would have 225 feet of road frontage. On the original parcel Charles Cousino plans to remove the existing foundation, build a new foundation with a new 2-bedroom house in 2007 (the current residence has 5 bedrooms), and install a new Presby septic system. The existing doublewide will be moved to the 3.9 acres with a designed mound type septic system. The septic and replacement area drawings for the two lots are in the works. The surveyor will survey the lots, but Charles Cousino wanted to make sure this subdivision met with PC approval before proceeding.
Susie Leonard confirmed if the parcel was zoned RA2. It was. Allen Karnatz asked if there were any set back issues with other buildings that may be close to the line. Charles Cousino indicated that he and Paul would make it work, if there were set back issues.
Allen Karnatz asked if the surveyor would have the final Mylar done for the deadline (April 19, 2006) for the May PC meeting. Charles Cousino did not feel the surveyor would have any problem making the deadline for the May PC meeting, so he would like to have this subdivision warned for the May 2006 PC meeting. Charles also indicated that residential construction will begin April 2007, but he would like to have the septic systems done now.
Susie Leonard made the motion to warn for minor subdivision for the May 2006 meeting.
Tom Boise seconded
Discussion – none
Vote: Yes – 5 No -0 Abstention – 0
Motion carries
Cris Messerle asked Regional Planning (RP) for clarification regarding a 2 acre lot when the PC regulations call for the lot to be 1 lot deep. There is no definition of what 1 lot deep means. RP opinion is the dwelling would have to be within the 2 acre zone with sufficient road frontage. Susie Leonard indicated that the house needed to be 100 feet back from the road because that is the setback. RP is assuming that the RA2 zoning does not apply to the whole lot, because the lot is larger than 2 acres, so RP is assuming that the RA 2 applies to the first 2 acres, and the backside is in other zoning.
b) Fred Lathrop wishes to subdivide his 11+ acres into two lots, property located on Dog Team Road.
No Show.
c) Allen Bessette wishes to subdivide his property, located on Quarry Road.
Allen Bessette indicated that he wishes to subdivide his property of 4.9 acres into 2 lots. The south lot would include the existing house and 2 +/- acres, the north lot would be vacant at this time. The parcel has not been surveyed at this time. Test pits have been done with Kevin LaRose and the State Engineer. A replacement area has been identified for the house and a primary and replacement for the other lot.
Allen Karnatz indicated that the sketch does not show where the dividing line between the 2 lots would be. Allen Bessette indicated that the location of the line has not been decided yet but it will be somewhere in the middle.
Allen Karnatz indicated that there is sufficient road frontage, 1,000 +/- feet. The lot is long and narrow and lot depth varies. A variance from the Zoning Board of Adjustment (ZBA) may be necessary if there is not sufficient set back. This is RA2, and a requirement of 100 ft from centerline of road is needed.
Tim Bouton spoke up as a member of the ZBA and asked that the PC not create a lot that the ZBA would have to deal with. Allen Karnatz indicated that if the survey indicated problems regarding sufficient setback, then it would be recommended to Allen Bessette that he go before the ZBA before coming before the PC for approval.
John Madden indicated that the regulations indicate the lot depth is defined as ‘mean horizontal distance’. John asked for clarification as to the definition of ‘mean horizontal distance’. Allen Karnatz indicated that it means taking out the high and low distances and adjust the medians. Don Johnston indicated that the ‘mean horizontal depth’ should be showed on the survey. This should be brought to the attention of the surveyor.
Allen Bessette would like to warn this for the June 2006 meeting.
Allen Karnatz indicated that if the survey work indicates that there is an issue with the mean lot depth measurements then Allen Bessette should go to the ZBA first, before coming to the PC.
Jim Walsh made the motion to warn this minor subdivision for the June 2006 meeting.
Susie Leonard seconded
Discussion – none
Vote: Yes – 5 No – 0 Abstention – 0
Motion carries
d) Mike Dunbar of Middlebury Fence Co., Ethan Allen Hwy., wishes to discuss a proposal to have his property rezoned commercial. The property is presently zoned RA-10.
Mike Dunbar introduced his wife, Christine Dunbar and their attorney, Kevin Brennan. After looking at the zoning map it was discussed that it is commercial zoned along the east side of Route 7. There is no commercial zone along the west side of Route 7. Kevin Brennan indicated that Mike and Christine Dunbar brought the property and the business -Middlebury Fence Company - 2 years ago from Mark Smith. At that time Mike and Christine Dunbar came before the PC to make sure the business, Middlebury Fence Company, could operate as a home based business on this property with some restrictions. The ZBA had granted a home occupancy permit with conditions. The permit that was issued permitted workers to come, drop off their vehicles, gather materials needed for the days work, and then head out to the site. Thus they would not be on-site during the daytime hours. Mike Dunbar was in the process of erecting a building when Cris Messerle, zoning administrator for the Town, put a halt on the construction of the building. The building is partially constructed and Mike and Christine Dunbar are uncertain what to do and how to proceed as they would like to put retail sales in the building. The home occupation worked for a while, but the business has grown and they seek to change from a home occupation in a residential zone to a commercial use. Mike and Christine do not intend to operate outside of zoning compliance and are coming before the PC for input and guidance about what to do.
Susie Leonard asked what business Mark Smith had on the property. Mike Dunbar indicated it was White River Timber Framing and the frames were built in the barn. Mark Smith also constructed the pole barn which is in violation with the zoning regulations if it used solely for commercial use. Mike and Christine Dunbar will be addressing this issue with the ZBA at the next scheduled ZBA meeting.
Cris Messerle presented his side. Prior to Cris Messerle taking over from Keith Hall (former zoning administrator), Keith had indicated this site as an area of concern. One of the main concerns was that fencing materials were being stored outside and this was in violation of the home occupation condition issued by the ZBA. One of the home occupancy conditions indicated that Middlebury Fence Company could store materials in the large barn. Workers could come in the morning and pick up job materials, leave for the job site, and come back at night. The home occupation office was to be used for administrative purposes only. Approximately 1 to 1 ½ weeks later Cris Messerle noticed the four walls up for the log cabin structure. Keith Hall had issued a building permit for a new storage barn/garage. The proposed purpose for the new structure was for outbuilding storage. The log cabin structure obviously does not look like it is for storage. Because of the erection of the building, Cris stopped by to see what was going on, and issued a violation which will be reviewed by the ZBA.
Susie Leonard indicated that the area is planned and zoned residential. She believes that there are a number of people within the Town that would not like to see commercial areas spreading along Route 7. As this business is operating now and with the large sign, it does not look or feel like a home occupation business. Susie felt that if the signs were removed and the retail sales eliminated it could stay there. If not, Susie felt the Dunbar’s needed to look for a commercial zoned site to move the business too. The current site is not planned or zoned for what the Dunbar’s want to do with it.
Christine Dunbar indicated that this is why they have come before the PC, to get input on what would work at this location. The Dunbar’s are willing to landscape, etc. to make the property more attractive.
Don Johnston’s feeling of concern was that this site was not zoned commercial.
Kevin Brennan asked if there was a process to come before the PC with a plan for a minor change, and the PC could urge the Select Board to change the zoning on this parcel. Susie Leonard did not feel that this situation was a minor change, going from residential to commercial.
Tom Boise indicated that the Dunbar’s could do a petition to petition the town to change the zoning in that area and force the town to vote. Kevin Brennan indicated that the Dunbar’s did not want proceed in that direction.
John Madden indicated that the previous business at this location (White River Framing) was not a conforming use. John also read the home occupation regulations and he does not feel that the current use of the property conforms to the home occupation regulations. John was also not in favor of spot zoning, which he feels would be the case if the zoning was changed to highway commercial solely for this parcel.
Allen Karnatz asked if anyone on the Board felt strongly about making a recommendation to change this parcels zoning to commercial. This would include making a recommendation to the Select Board for a change of zoning and it would have to go though the necessary public hearings.
Don Johnston felt that there was not much the PC could do to change this. He felt the PC could interpret and point the Dunbar’s in the right direction, but did not feel that the PC would advocate for the Dunbar’s.
Steve Duposie indicated that this property has been a commercial site, all along.
Jim Walsh felt it should go before the town for a vote. Allen Karnatz felt that the timing was not optimum, because new zoning and subdivision bylaws are going to the public for a vote and this might confuse the issue.
Tom Boise felt that all of Route 7 should be commercial zoned and remove the neighborhood commercial zoning in the “down town” area of New Haven.
Cris Messerle mentioned that the Town Attorney (Jim Ouimette) said spot zoning is illegal.
Both Susie Leonard and Allen Karnatz indicated that the Dunbar’s could continue to use the site as a home occupancy and without the retail commercial use.
e) Representatives of Vermont Railway and Phoenix Feed wish to discuss leasing of railway owned property located the former White Pigment Site.
Jim Walsh recused himself, as he is a competitor.
David Wulfson, representative of Vermont Railway (VTRR), indicated that they have recently purchased the property. The intention is to create rail business, as they have done throughout the State. Phoenix Feeds is a new client of theirs. Phoenix has a few rail cars now, with more coming, and will be moving grain products in and out of the building. VTRR is maintaining the maintenance shop, but are looking for a tenant for other pieces of the property. David introduced Curtis Cyr from Claremont Forest, which VTRR hopes will be a new client. Items moved through the RR are exempted by federal law from State and local zoning control. David Wulfson indicated that they would be happy to provide the necessary paperwork to the Town Attorney to back this federal law. VTRR does need to follow State safety codes for building, federal and environmental laws, and VTRR has a duty to work with the town on development, input, etc. as long as it doesn’t jeopardize the intermodal business operations.
The entire site is now a rail transfer property/distribution facility. As VTRR has a plan or as usages are assured VTRR will come to the PC in a boarder sense of what VTRR plans to do, and to address safety issues, etc.
Cris Messerle indicated that VTRR does have an obligation to come before the Town. During his research and discussion with Regional Planning, the sheds that are now used for the RR and equipment are exempt. Other rental(s) once they are not under the RR envelope, need to meet local and State Laws and requirements.
David Wulfson indicated that interstate commerce is under RR jurisdictions. He was here tonight to address safety, traffic patterns. etc.
Susie Leonard indicated that the VTRR would need to work with the State regarding Route 7 egress and ingress.
Allen Karnatz indicated that the PC has jurisdiction over the leasor (VTRR) and the leasees, regarding change of use. Allen asked if new structures are being planned to be built. David Wulfson indicated no, not yet. The VTRR is not leasing the building. The product is moving from the rail cars through the building onto trucks.
Susie Leonard indicated that at some point in time the PC would need to address the issue of; would this be considered a freight or trucking terminal?
Cris Messerle’s concern is how the PC will approach the change of use issues. Cris felt that the Town’s attorney should become involved. Allen Karnatz agreed.
John Madden indicated he was happy to see commercial use happening at the Junction. Felt that David Wulfson should look at the PC regulations regarding industrial zoning and suggest that the attorneys put their findings in writing.
Visitors business ended at 9:00 PM.
4. New Business
Zoning By-Laws/Regulations: Allen Karnatz indicated that the Zoning By-Laws/Regulations now agree with the Town Plan. Allen Karnatz indicated that the PC can make changes tonight, adopt it with changes and then bring it to a public hearing.
Tim Bouton discussed the changes that were made to the Zoning Regulations with the PC and he will make the changes on the draft copy and issue a final copy of the Zoning Regulations to be voted on at a public hearing.
Items that were address:
· Front yard set back identified from the center of the highway –Page 38 added
· Definition of front yard - added
· No definition for the word set back
· Principle Use and Principle Structure – were addressed
· Fire Department would like to see private driveways kept open to emergency vehicles. – this would be done by separate ordinance
· Fire Department asked if building height requirements should be addressed.
· Definition for change of use – added.
· Add a footer with date.
· Correct map title
Susie Leonard made the motion to approve the Zoning and Subdivision By-laws/Regulations with changes and to present them at a public hearing.
Jim Walsh seconded.
Discussion – none
Vote Yes – 5 No – 0 Abstention – 0
Motion carries
Cris Messerle will try to schedule the public hearing for Monday, May 15, 2006, or Tuesday, May 16, 2006.
2. Minutes
Review of the minutes for the March 3, 2006, Planning Commission meeting. Susie Leonard indicated a correction should be made on Page 2. John Madden indicated a change.
Jim Walsh made the motion to accept the minutes with changes.
Tom Boise seconded
Discussion – none
Vote Yes – 5 No -0 Abstention – 0
Motion carries
3. Correspondence
4. New Business - continued
Cris Messerle asked if the PC would like him to contact the Town’s Attorney (Jim Ouimette) regarding the Vermont Railroad ruling. Jim Walsh indicated if there is change of ownership of the product, how would this affect VTRR rules. Cris Messerle felt the extension does not cover expansion and Cris felt this was an expansion of operation. It was the opinion of the PC that Cris should contact Jim Ouimette for clarification of the VTRR regulations.
5. Old Business
None
Susie Leonard made the motion to adjourn
Tom Boise seconded
Discussion – none
Vote Yes – 5 No – 0 Abstention – 0
Motion carries
The meeting was adjourned at 10:00 PM.
Respectfully Submitted By:
Karen Gallott