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New Haven Planning Commission
New Haven Town Hall
June 2, 2005
Members Present: Allen Karnatz, Jim Walsh, John Evers, Don Johnston, Keith Hall,
Tom Boise
Members Absent: Suzie Leonard
Guests: Glenn Stephenson, Sally Stephenson, John Madden, Charles Roy, Jamey Holstein, Eugene Charlebois, Anthony Dupree, Jamie Hutchins
The meeting was called to order at 7:00 PM
Public Hearing
1. Sue Perna and Jamie Hutchins, subdivision of 93 acres on Twitchell Hill Road. Continuation of the first hearing of a minor subdivision. SUB.7-04.
Allen Karnatz indicated that the Mylar presented tonight was not received within the required time frame (15 days prior) to the Planning Commission. Jamie Hutchins’ presented a new Mylar which shows the new lot lines making a total of 2 lots (Lots A and B). Keith Hall indicated that he did receive the Act 250 report. The Planning Commission Members reviewed the Mylar. Tom Boise indicated that he sees the easement for the force main but not the replacement. Jamie Hutchins indicated that he was told the septic did not need to be shown on the Mylar, but the septic systems are shown on the other paper maps. Don Johnston indicated that the systems were on the Mylar presented last month. After closer look Don Johnston indicated that the systems were shown on this Mylar and actually meets the requirements of the Planning Commission.
Vote by the Planning Commission Members indicated that the Mylar presented tonight met the needs of the Planning Commission. A vote was taken. All members were in agreement; yes this Mylar met the Planning Commission needs. This vote indicated that Jamie Hutchins did not have to change anything on the Mylar.
Allen Karnatz indicated that because this Mylar was not presented to the Planning Commission 15 days in advance it did not meet the full requirements for approval. Jamie Hutchins was asked whether he wanted to continue this hearing to the July 2005 meeting, or whether he wanted conditional approval of the Mylar tonight, but not record it until after 15 days have passed. Jim Walsh asked if the Planning Commission could approve the Mylar at the June 23 meeting. Allen Karnatz indicated that it would be best to stick with the normal Planning Commission meeting.
Don Johnston made the motion that the Planning Commission approve the Mylar under the condition that it is held for 15 days for public viewing. At the end of the 15 day period, if the public does not contest the Mylar, the Planning Commission will sign and approve it.
Tom Boise seconded the motion.
Discussion:
John Evers questioned what would the procedure be if someone did have an issued with this Mylar? To whom would they voice their concern with, since there would not be a regularly scheduled opened public Planning Commission meeting?
Tom Boise indicated that if there was opposition, than it would trigger approval of the Mylar to the regularly scheduled Planning Commission meeting in July.
John Evers’ concern was that the Planning Commission would be making up procedures on the fly.
Vote on the motion:
Yes – 2 No –4 Abstentions – 0
Motion did not carry. Indicating that this hearing will continue at the July meeting.
The Public Hearing Section Closed at 7:30 PM.
Visitors Business
1. James Schaefer’s agent, Jamey Holstein, presented a sketch plan for a major 4-lot subdivision on Schaefer’s (former Pabst’s land) property on Route 17, abutting Field Days property. There would be two 10+ acre lots and one 5.4 acre lot.
Tom Boise asked how the 5.4 acre lot would be accessed. Jamey Holstein indicated that there would be one highway cut off Route 17 and the proposed 3 lots would be accessed by use of the current Class 4 road.
Don Johnston indicated that the right-of-way needs to be 50 feet, not 30 feet.
Don Johnston asked if the proposed 3 lots would have a shared system. Jamey Holstein indicated that they would.
Allen Karnatz asked if Jamey Holstein was looking for a sketch approval tonight. Yes they were.
Allen Karnatz asked if Jamey Holstein knew of any other subdivision plans for this acreage since this was a large tract of land. Jamey did not know of any further subdivisions planned at this time.
Jamey Holstein asked the Planning Commission members if they wanted 2 Mylar’s. Allen Karnatz indicated that 2 Mylar’s makes it clearer. Allen also asked Jamey if he was familiar with the Planning Commission Regulations concerning a major subdivision and all that was required: showing septic and well sites; showing contours, etc. It was indicated that State approved for access from the Class 4 road needed to be obtained.
Jamey Holstein presented another plan showing proposed house sites.
John Evers’ made the motion to approve this sketch plan for a major subdivision, for the July meeting.
Tom Boise seconded.
Discussion – none.
Vote: Yes – 6 No – 0 Abstention – 0
Motion carries.
2. Charlie Roy presented a minor subdivision sketch plan tonight. Charlie Roy is selling the development rights of about 78 acres of land and buildings on the west side of South Street. After the development rights have been sold, Charlie plans on selling this property to the person that is currently renting the farm. The prospective buyer for the farm also wants to exclude 2 acres from the VT Land Trust for possible future development. Charlie Roy would like to keep 2 acres and the existing house.
Charlie is coming to the Planning Commission tonight to present a minor subdivision to subdivide the existing house and 2 acres from the remaining acreage.
Allen Karnatz indicated that he will need to abstain from voting on this discussion as he does work for the VT Land Trust. Don Johnston indicated that he too will need to abstain as he is the surveyor for this property.
Charlie Roy would like approval for the July Planning Commission meeting. Keith Hall asked if Charlie Roy has sought approval for a Water and Wastewater permit from the State.
Jim Walsh made the motion to accept the sketch plan for a minor subdivision for the July meeting.
Keith Hall seconded.
Discussion – none
Vote: Yes – 4 No – 0 Abstention – 2 (Allen Karnatz, Don Johnston)
Motion Carries.
3. Eugene Charlebois and Anthony Dupree (attorney representing Charlebois) presented a previously approved subdivision showing common shared septic areas on Lot 1. When they went to the State for approval and permit, Jeff Kelly changed the plan and now Lot 2 has its own on-site septic and has State permit approval for Lot 2, but it is different from the original Mylar that was recorded.
Anthony Dupree asked what the Planning Commission’s pleasure was regarding the amended Mylar. Anthony Dupree indicated that the remained lots will most likely be revised to have on-site septic or some lots may have a shared septic. Jeff Kelly has not finished the designs for the remaining lots. But, Eugene Charlebois will have a state approved system for each lot before it is sold.
Allen Karnatz asked if Eugene Charlebois would be coming back to the Planning Commission with an amended Mylar as each lot is sold. Anthony Dupree indicated that their intention is to only have 1 amended Mylar that shows the separate systems for each lot. At this time due to financial reasons Eugene Charlebois has deferred plans for the remaining lots and are just going ahead with the plan and development of Lot 2.
Allen Karnatz indicated that approval of an amended Mylar could be approved at any Planning Commission meeting and it would not have to be warned. Anthony Dupree indicated that he would like to have the Planning Commissions approval as soon as possible. If the Planning Commission could conditionally approve the plan tonight that would be great. Allen Karnatz indicated that he could come in and sign a Mylar that has been conditionally approved. Or this could be put on the July agenda, or it could be approved at the June 23 meeting.
Allen Karnatz made the motion the Planning Commission conceptually approve the amended Mylar with the final review on June 23, 2005.
John Evers seconded.
Discussion – none
Vote: Yes – 5 No – 0 Abstention – 1 (Don Johnston)
Motion Carries.
Visitors Business ended at 8:15 PM.
Review of Minutes for May 2005
John Evers made the change under Public Hearing, #1; the paragraph beginning Allen Karnatz indicated…The word continuous should be contiguous.
Jim Walsh made the motion to approve the minutes as amended. Keith Hall seconded.
Discussion – none.
Vote Yes – 5 No – 0 Abstention – 1 (John Evers)
Correspondence
New Business – none.
Old Business
Keith Hall mentioned the survey sent out by John Madden and approximately 100 surveys were returned to the Town of New Haven and never opened. Keith Hall also mentioned that he spoke with Jim Ouimette (Town’s lawyer) on this matter and the surveys are not considered public record because they have not been tabulated.
There was considerable discussion concerning what to do with these surveys amongst the Planning Commission members. Discussion ranged from were these surveys Town property or public record? Should the surveys be turned over to John Madden. Should they be destroyed, or put unopened in a box and stored. Should they be turned over to the Selectboard and the Town’s lawyer for them to make a decision? Should they be returned unopened to the persons that sent them in and if so, who would foot the bill for returning, the Town or John Madden? What would be the liabilities to the town?
John Madden indicated what he would like to tabulate the results of the surveys and turn the results over to the Town. He also explained that it was his honest intention so get information out to the public and saw no harm in what he did. He also was unwilling to foot the bill if the surveys were returned to the individuals that sent them in. If, the surveys were destroyed, he would see it as destroying a public record and might fight this decision.
The Planning Commission could not come to a consensus regarding a plan of action. It was decided that Allen Karnatz would write a letter to the New Haven Selectmen indicating the Planning Commissions recommendations of: storing the surveys but not as a public record; or destroying the surveys; or returning the surveys to the individuals; or tabulating the results separately from the town survey. All members agreed that the surveys should not be returned to John Madden.
A Planning Commission work session is planned for June 23 at 7:00PM. This meeting will be open for public comment and exposure to the Town Plan
Allen Karnatz presented a Certificate of Appreciation to Art Sherman for serving 9 years on the Planning Commission Board.
The Planning Commission needs to act on Chapter 117 Rules and Procedures policy by September.
Tom Boise made the motion to adjourn.
John Evers seconded.
Discussion – none
Vote Yes - 6 No – 0 Abstention – 0
Motion carries.
Meeting adjourned at 9:30 PM
Respectfully Submitted By;
Karen Gallott