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New Haven Planning Commission Meeting
April 7, 2005
New Haven Town Hall
Members Present: Allen Karnatz, Tom Boise, John Evers, Susan Leonard, Don Johnston,
Keith Hall
Members Absent: none
Guests: Eugene Cousino, Linda Cousino, George Brewer, Courtney Butler, William Allenson, Marilyn Grice, Kevin LaRose, Denton Lyon, Pat Colander, John Madden, Delores Norris, Pete Norris Sr., Burt Allen.
The meeting was called to order at 7:00 PM.
Public Hearing
1) Denton Lyon is here for the final review of a major subdivision of his land located on Main Street (Route 17) east of the Fire Station into 6 parcels. SUB 6-04.
Kevin LaRose, from Lincoln Applied Geology, Inc. presented to the Planning Commission the final Mylar. Denton Lyon indicated that the access to Lot #5 was resolved by using an existing access that goes past Denton Lyon's house, the barn and up the hill to Lot #5. At this time all the pins are in.
Allen Karnatz opened up to the public for comments. There were no comments from the public at this time.
John Evers' indicated that the changes requested at the last Planning Commission meeting were made. Allen Karnatz indicated to Denton Lyon that if there were a change in the right-of-way access for Lot #5, then Denton Lyon would have to come back to the Planning Commission for approval.
Tom Boise made the motion to accept this final subdivision and vote on it as presented.
Keith Hall seconded.
Discussion – none.
Vote: Yes – 4 No – 0 Abstention – 1 (Susan Leonard)
Donald Johnston was not present for the vote.
Motion Carries.
2) Pete Norris Sr., first of a preliminary hearing to subdivide his property on the west side of Ethan Allen Highway (Route 7). SUB 1-05. The sketch plan was approved at the March 3, 2005 meeting of the Planning Commission.
Pete Norris Sr., indicated that there were no changes made since the approval of the sketch plan. Pete Norris, Sr., then proceeded to explain his plans to the public. Allen Karnatz asked if there were any comments from the public.
Allen Karnatz indicated that the Planning Commission received a letter on March 30, 2005 from the Champlain Valley Greenbelt Alliance specifically in regards to traffic and the need for a qualified engineer study of such, stormwater runoff, and utilities concerns that have not been addressed in this proposal. Pete Norris Sr., indicated that this information would be addressed when he went forward into ACT 250 approval. He did not want to address these issues at this time until he was certain to get local permitting first. Pete Norris, Sr., indicated that all utilities will be underground and wanted to make sure the records indicated this.
John Evers asked if Pete Norris, Sr. would have any objections making this (utilities are to be underground) a condition for final approval. Pete Norris Sr., indicated that he would have no objections.
Pete Norris Sr., asked as a matter of precedence and practice before approval on the preliminary would the Planning Commission would require road design, erosion control, stormwater runoff designs, because if it wasn't asked for other subdivisions, he would hope that his subdivision would be treated the same. Allen Karnatz indicated that in the past this information had not been asked for before the preliminary approval. On the other hand this is the largest commercial subdivision based on the current Zoning. Based on other site plan reviews in the past, the Planning Commission has asked for extension traffic study.
Allen Karnatz asked if there were any comments from the public.
John Madden presented 2 handouts to the public regarding thoughts on this proposed subdivision. Allen Karnatz asked if there was any rebuttal from the Planning Commission members. There was none.
Burt Allen addressed John Madden's traffic concerns as it was presented in the handout. Burt Allen didn't agree with the traffic concerns presented, as there are now 70 to 100 trucks/day going out of Pike's and there have not been any accidents. He felt any additional traffic on Route 7 from this subdivision would not be a problem.
Don Johnston asked if the septic design had been revised since it was first presented. Pete Norris, Sr., indicated that it had changed. Now, there are 2 septic plans. 1 commercial plan which supports 120 to 130 employees. The commercial wastewater design is shown on the plans with primary and secondary. The other septic plan is for the residential property.
Allen Karnatz asked about commercial access off of Dog Team Road. Pete Norris Sr., indicated that the north end of Dog Team Road would be residential access only. Pete Norris Sr., indicated the loop off of Route 7 and up to Campground Road would extend up to Lot #5.
Pat Colander indicated that as a Dog Team Road resident, she approved of the new proposal that limited access onto Dog Team Road only for the existing residential lot.
John Evers made the motion to approve the plan presented on a preliminary basis as follows: Tom Boise seconded.
1. The preliminary plat has been met, or met as best as it can be met at this time given the nature of this proposal.
2. The overall map with contours, parcel boundaries, septic design, etc. is more than reasonably complete.
3. The proposed use fits with Zoning and the Town Plan, fits with what is allowed within the regulations at this time.
4. Pete Norris Sr., has addressed the traffic concerns of the local residences.
Pete Norris Sr., wants to make sure that it was stated in these minutes, that he volunteers to have all utilities underground for this project. He will also make every attempt to have the stormwater plan and road design available for his next Planning Commission hearing.
Allen Karnatz asked Planning Commission members if they wanted to state any conditions now or wait until the final approval hearing. Allen Karnatz, went on to say that it made more sense and makes it clearer to state any conditions now so the applicant knows upfront what is expected and what he needs to bring to the final hearing.
Susan Leonard expressed a traffic concern with regards to the intersections of Campground Road, Hunt Road and Route 7. Would the State address any concerns to alleviate traffic problems here. Burt Allen indicated that he would see what information he could find out regarding the State's 1995-96 plans for this section of road.
Don Johnston made the motion to make an amendment to the motion. Susan Leonard seconded.
The following amendment conditions shall be noted on the approval:
1. Underground utilities.
2. No commercial access off Dog Team Road.
3. Stormwater plan and road design will be available at the final hearing.
4. Alter the plans to show the access to Lot #5.
Discussion on the amendment – none.
Vote on the amendment Yes – 6 No – 0 Abstentions – 0
Motion carries.
Discussion on the original motion with the conditions attached. – none.
Vote on the original motion Yes – 5 No – 0 Abstentions – 1 (Susan Leonard)
Motion carries.
Pete Norris, Sr., indicated that he could possibly be back for the final hearing in 2 months.
Allen Karnatz indicated that a formal petition has been presented regarding a change in the Zoning regulations along Route 7, and he asked if the petition would impact this application. Keith Hall indicated that he will be meeting with Jim Ouimette, Esq. soon and will discuss this potential issue.
Pete Norris, Sr. stated that it is his understanding that his proposal would not be impacted by the petition because his application was submitted under the existing regulations.
Burt Allen pointed out to the Planning Commission to make sure that all the signatures on the petition are valid.
Public Hearing Section Closed at 8:20 PM.
Visitor's Business
1. Francis Sturtevant – no show.
2. Burt Allen – Proposes to erect a 40' x 60' building, due south, for storage purposes only at the location of his business New Haven Tire on Hunt Road. This would be a cold storage only; no windows, clear roof panels only; no heat; no power. The building would have a 12' x 12' overhear door and a fast door.
Tom Boise made the motion to warn this commercial site review for the May 2005 Planning Commission meeting. Keith Hall seconded.
Discussion – none.
Vote Yes – 6 No – 0 Abstentions – 0
Motion carries.
3. Eugene and Linda Cousino – Wanted to get the Planning Commission thoughts on a possible 3 lot subdivision of their land on Town Hill Road. Since this lot does not have much road frontage Eugene Cousino was seeking advise on what he needed to do.
Allen Karnatz indicated that they would not have to go through Act 250, but they would have to provide legal access to any interior lots. Each lot would have to be at least 10 acres in size to meet zoning regulations. Each lot would have to show full septic designs. A sketch plan would need to be presented to the Planning Commission. Eventually a survey will need to be done. The roads will need to be built to State specifications, and wide enough for fire/rescue vehicles. Eugene Cousino indicated that utilities would be underground from the existing poles. If it was subdivided into more than 2 lots that would be a major subdivision and require 2 hearings and be subjected to more detailed planning.
John Evers suggested that the Cousino's talk with a engineer to see what they would suggest regarding septic and the economics of doing this plan.
4. Marilyn Grice wants to subdivide a 2 acre or larger parcel off the land that borders on Halpin Road. The land has been perked and they will be doing some more additional testing of water levels to ensure an alternative system. Rest of the property is in current use. Once this subdivision takes place the rest of the field will then be put into current use. It would need to be warned to Keith Hall 15 days before the meeting that this would be presented to the Planning Commission. Keith Hall indicated that this would be a minor subdivision (i.e. 2 lots), and everything could be done at one meeting if the Mylar was done and presented at that time.
Marilyn Grice asked if an actual septic plan needed to be presented. Allen Karnatz indicated that the primary and replacement septic plans need to be shown on the Mylar. Marilyn will be back at a future meeting for sketch plan review. It was decided not to warn this for the May meeting.
Visitor's Business closed at 8:45 PM.
Other Business
Keith Hall indicated that Tom Fisher, Hallock Road, had contact him regarding putting in a business in his garage, which is about 100 ft from his house. Keith indicated that he didn't think Tom could, but instead a business could be set up in the house. This would have to go before the Zoning Board.
Butler Subdivision on Cobble Road (1988), this came before the board 2 or 3 months ago. Mr. Barrara (lawyer) wants to come and discuss this with the Planning Commission in the future. Apparently there is a question about what was permitted back in 1988.
Discussion continued on the Denton Lyon Mylar that was presented tonight. It was discussed that two Mylars should have been presented for this project, one that shows the boundaries and monumentation and one that shows the contours, building envelopes, septic and well locations.. The Mylar that was approved this evening only had the boundaries and monumentation.
Tom Boise made the motion that Denton Lyon would have to prepare and bring to Keith Hall a second Mylar containing all the septic locations (primary and secondary), well locations, contours and building envelopes and corrections would need to be made on the approved Mylar. John Evers seconded.
Discussion – none
Vote Yes – 6 No – 0 Abstentions – 0
Motion carries.
More discussion was initiated regarding the Mylar Denton Lyon presented tonight. Don Johnston indicated that there are monumentation errors and inaccurate survey coordinates on the approved Mylar. John Ever's indicated that a corrected Mylar will have to be presented before the Town Clerk could record it.
Tom Boise made the motion to reopen the subdivision. John Ever's seconded.
Discussion – John Ever's explained that the reason the Planning Commission was reopening the subdivision was in reviewing the Mylar in greater detail a number of inaccuracies and discrepancies were identified.
Vote Yes – 6 No – 0 Abstentions – 0
Motion carries.
It was decided not to reopen it to a public hearing. Keith would contact Kevin LaRose and Denton Lyon to inform them of the decision and vote tonight.
Old Business
A work night meeting on the town plan and survey is scheduled with Brandy Saxton for April 21, at 6:30.
Susan Leonard left early.
Correspondence
Monkton's proposed new zoning and subdivision regulations with corrected maps.
Kate Lampton's letter from the Champlain Valley Greenbelt Alliance to Pete Norris Sr., regarding his subdivision.
Review of Meetings for March 2005
John Madden indicated corrections to be made on page 4 and page 5.
There were no other changes or corrections.
Allen Karnatz made the motion to approve the minutes with changes. Keith Hall seconded.
Vote Yes – 5 No – 0 Abstentions – 0
New Business
Allen Karnatz presented a draft response to John Madden's petition to amend the zoning regulations along Route 7. This draft was reviewed by the Planning Commission members and discussed. Based on the discussion, Allen Karnatz will rewrite a simpler response. It was decided to have a public hearing on the petition at the regular May meeting. Keith Hall will add it to the warning.
Allen Karnatz indicated the Planning Commission needs to adopt formal rules of procedures by September 2005. John Evers will work with the Regional Planning Commission on this.
Susan Leonard was introduced as the new member of the Planning Commission she replaces Art Sherman. Jim Walsh is being appointed to the Zoning Board. The Planning Commission has one available seat. Allen Karnatz made the motion to reappoint Keith Hall was as the Zoning Administrator. Tom Boise seconded.
Discussion – none
Vote Yes – 4 No –0 Abstention – 1 Keith Hall
Don Johnston made the motion to adjourn. Keith Hall seconded.
Vote Yes – 5 No – 0 Abstention – 0
The meeting adjourned at 10:00 PM.
Respectfully Submitted by:
Karen Gallott